2559. Adrianne - Sep. 1, 1998 - 8:59 AM PDT
Phil
Please email me at home or work - like (it seems) everybody else, I only have your email address on my work computer.
2560. trouserPilot - Sep. 1, 1998 - 9:02 AM PDT
adrianne
Cool brother's website! Thanx for the link. But... your warnings about his music being too "outside" for my tastes ... would anybody like to set adrianne straight on this? Phil? Kurt?
Kurt
I read about that plastic water tower thing in the NYTimes. Glad you got to see it, even if I didn't. No really, I'm happy for you and not the least bit jealous and resentful.
2561. Coralreef - Sep. 2, 1998 - 11:07 PM PDT
An interesting (to me anyway) Salon Article on a feud in the comics world.
2562. Philistine - Sep. 3, 1998 - 4:45 AM PDT
Damn, Coral, you beat me to it! I was just gonna post that (note to Kurt, the article features a strip with the creme de la creme of the comics world watching "Teletubbies."
2563. labarjare - Sep. 3, 1998 - 7:27 PM PDT
Kurt - I somehow assumed you would find that Whiteread. What a terrific idea. I've only seen the picture in the Times but it was what we used to call quite cool.
2564. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 3, 1998 - 10:33 PM PDT
lab:
It actually took us awhile to find it....we stood on the corner of Broadway and Grand for a good 20 minutes looking up and scratching our heads before realizing we needed to be on W. Broadway. I don't suppose we looked all that out of place, though. Stopped into the French culinary school on the corner there for a drink to collect ourselves and watched 3 other people do the same thing (scratch their heads, that is, not stop in for a drink).
2565. Coralreef - Sep. 4, 1998 - 3:16 PM PDT
This thread clearly needs more Wabbit.
Philistine - I posted that link hoping you'd comment on it! Thanks, I knew it was up your alley, and an interesting article to boot. There's another Salon article that was printed recently with regard to art, this time having to do with a man who did what Salon called performance art in railing against capitalism in a full page ad and getting censored/edited because of it.
2566. Philistine - Sep. 6, 1998 - 5:47 AM PDT
You wanted comments, CR, you got it!
In a way, the strips Salon published (excerpted from Zap 14) are typical of most comics 'jams' - It's not very compelling, and not very collaborative. Everyone got their own pages, I don't see any evidence of more than one hand at work in any given panel. Although Mavrides' imitation of Crumb's style is dead on, I've seen it put to better effect in a single panel gag called "R Crumb's nightmare" depicting Crumb with a big booty and muscular legs while being hooted at with lurid approval.
I can't help but feel that Crumb is right - Zap ain't much anymore. Fourteen issues in 28 years? What kind of publishing schedule is that for a 30 page black and white book? Anyway, while none of the guys involved are even remotely washed up (well, maybe Shelton is) they are all doing much more interesting work in longer formats. I've mentioned "Self-Loathing Comix" here before, but to reiterate, it is a true jam between R and Aline Kominsky, his wife, along with contributions from their daughter Sophie and a few other luminaries (notably Art Spiegelman and hmm, I forget, but I think it was Gary Panter). Spain has one major work out now, and another coming in spring. Those are "Boots" (written by Jim Madow) and "Nightmare Alley" an adaptation of the William Lindsay Gresham novel, respectively. Mavrides no doubt left the planet in the Subgenius exodus in July. I know little about Moscoso, but find the description of his art as 'minimal' by Callahan perplexing - it seems to have about the same degree of visual business as the rest.
2567. Philistine - Sep. 6, 1998 - 5:49 AM PDT
As for this business of Zap being the greatest underground comic of all time, well it is obviously just self-horn-tootin' hooey. Crumb himself says it - "We're just a bunch of characters from a Dan Clowes comic!" Not that Eightball is the greatest of shakes, either (although some stories in there, like "Caricature" and "Ghost World" are brilliant comics) just that there is plenty more to see than a bunch of greybeard hippies getting naughty the same way they did 30 years ago.
Speaking of greybeard hippies, "Dance Of The Gull Catchers", the epilog to Alan Moore and Eddie Campbell's "From Hell" has hit the streets. A brief history of the popular press' obsession with Jack the Ripper, it is pulled of with typical effortlessly brilliant elan. For my money, Eddie Campbell is the most sensitive, humanist artist working in comics today, and Alan Moore still sits at the top of the heap when it comes to writing sophisticated and complex stories. Being a work of journalism, rather than fiction, "Gull Catchers" doesn't really show either one to their greatest advantage, but Kitchen Sink Press recently reissued Eddie's opus "Graffiti Kitchen" and they are also keeping the previous issues of "From Hell" in print. This is the real good stuff, kiddies, and I recommend both to anyone old enough to handle them.
2568. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 7, 1998 - 11:11 PM PDT
By chance, I happened to catch something I never thought I'd see this evening.....Great Rancoteur of the Mundane, Sister Wendy taking on Action Painting and Ab-Ex. As if that weren't enough, she catalogued Rothko, Pollack, Newman, De Kooning, &c with her customary zeal and breathless naivite: "It ith awthethome to be this cwowse to thith wevew of cweativity, even though Jackthon Powwack was a macho, owcohowic type". Indeed.
2569. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 7, 1998 - 11:24 PM PDT
My, god, now she's talking about Agnes Martin. This is too much, really.
2570. patsyrolph - Sep. 8, 1998 - 12:31 AM PDT
Now, now, Mondaugen:
First you bash Vermont and now you're being mean about Sister Wendy. Sheesh. Please accept my nomination as Mondaugen-Curmudgeon for the end of the 20th Century.
2571. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 8, 1998 - 1:44 AM PDT
I do a stupendous rendition of Sister Wendy discoursing on great big phalluses. Bucked teeth, crouched back, lisping -- you name it.
2572. patsyrolph - Sep. 8, 1998 - 1:51 AM PDT
Drat! Now PE has made me laugh at Sister Wendy.
2573. wabbit - Sep. 8, 1998 - 8:00 AM PDT
Message #2571
I think a recording is in order.
2574. trouserPilot - Sep. 8, 1998 - 10:23 AM PDT
#2571
Streaming video! Streaming video! I'll loan you my wimple
2575. trouserPilot - Sep. 8, 1998 - 10:23 AM PDT
.
2576. Philistine - Sep. 9, 1998 - 4:14 AM PDT
Sorry, not Gary Panter, it was Charles Burns.
On an unrelated note, I agree with TP and Wabbit, except that streaming video sucks. I'd be happy to buy an hour-long video of PE's nightclub entertainment styled antics, though. Ever considered a career in Vegas, Pseud?
2577. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 9, 1998 - 4:53 AM PDT
What the hell is a streaming video?
The nightclub routines that I can do (superlatively):
• Sister Wendy, ibid.
• an ultra-garrulous speaker of generic faux Chinese (every word is gibberish, but indisputably Chinese to non-speakers)
• Queen Elizabeth and her "anus horribilis"
• a jabbering sub-con professor of economics outlining the decision tree for an Indian woman's throwing herself into her husband's funeral pyre
• a castrato French clown declaiming Racine, a sort of Francophone Pee-Wee Herman (still imperfect; it frequently degenerates into a whiny Mexican)
• Prince Charles talking about the carbuncle on his beloved old friend, the loose lower lip
2578. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 9, 1998 - 4:55 AM PDT
No, no, no, a "monstrous carbuncle" on a beloved old friend of his....
2579. wabbit - Sep. 9, 1998 - 5:00 AM PDT
Hey, I'm still waiting for my copy of "Every Sperm is Sacred" sung in two different Indian dialects....
2580. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 9, 1998 - 5:04 AM PDT
still working working working....
But I can't even do "Every Sperm is Sacred" in English, in tenor w/o vibrato. I want to render it as though Mario Lanza himself were doing it.
2581. wabbit - Sep. 9, 1998 - 5:09 AM PDT
I have no doubt my patience will be amply rewarded.
2582. trouserPilot - Sep. 9, 1998 - 11:58 AM PDT
Sorry. For me it's Edith Piaf or nothing.
2583. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 3:14 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen –
Are you interested in Leonardo da Vinci's paintings? A large touring exhibition of his works is being shown Oct. 1 through Feb. 28 at the Royal British Columbia Museum in Victoria, BC. This will be the only Westcoast venue included in the tour, and it's a great excuse to take a ferry to Victoria for a romantic weekend this Winter. I saw the Codex Leicester when it was displayed at the Seattle Art Museum last year, and I am looking forward to seeing this exhibit too.
Here are some details:
Leonardo DaVinci in Victoria, BC
2584. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 3:39 PM PDT
Aren't they mostly charcoal drawings, rather than paintings? Anyway, how could Mondaugen like them? They depict people. Not dots or lines or 8-minute silences interrupted by a single note after the 6th minute.
2585. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 10, 1998 - 3:50 PM PDT
Sorry, Azure, but Pseud's at least partly right. Have a good time.
2586. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 3:58 PM PDT
There may be a painting or two, but you are right PE, the focus of the exhibition is on da Vinci as a scientist and inventor. His artistic expression will probably be portrayed mostly in illustations for his scientific endeavors, as it was for the Codex Leicester show. (I suppose illustrated technical documentation is easier for NW provencials to understand than straightforward painting.)
2587. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:02 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen -
Maybe you can find some other excuse to take a ferry to Victoria. You know they have something called "high tea" there?
2588. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:04 PM PDT
"I suppose illustrated technical documentation is easier for NW provencials to understand than straightforward painting."
Actually, wasn't the purpose of that show to essentially celebrate Bill Gates' purchasing power? Granted, a few interested folks actually got to see the thing, but much was made about how Gates was going to shuffle it off into a shoebox under his bed for the remainder of its shelf-life.
2589. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:06 PM PDT
And, btw, Victoria's great. It'll be at least a few months before we can take another vacation that would be worth the effort, though.
2590. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:12 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen -
I was pretty moved by being able to examine the document for myself. Seeing da Vinci's handwriting and drawings, following his thought processes in the translations, really brought him to life. Looking at his notebooks made me feel tangibly in the presence of a very great man. And I don't expect that the Codex is going to remain hidden away at all. I plan to read it again soon, more carefully.
2591. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:13 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen -
Well, have you tried this "high tea" thing?
2592. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:20 PM PDT
Azure:
I dunno, is it anything like "happy hour"?
And as far as the Codex goes, don't hold your breath. I got a promotional copy of the silly CD-ROM that accompanied the show, and from all indication that's about as close as anyone's going to get from here on in.
2593. labarjare - Sep. 10, 1998 - 4:37 PM PDT
At least it doesn't bear Armand Hammer's name anymore. That candidate for top ten worthless scumbags, commercial/political fringes division, of the 20th century.
2594. marjoribanks - Sep. 10, 1998 - 5:02 PM PDT
Well, Bulle is back.
2595. marjoribanks - Sep. 10, 1998 - 5:02 PM PDT
(g)
2596. labarjare - Sep. 10, 1998 - 5:17 PM PDT
(g) indeed, sir!!
2597. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 6:15 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen -
Re: Message #2592
What indications do you mean? I don't recall any explicit statements made that the Codex would not be exhibited again.
2598. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 10, 1998 - 6:32 PM PDT
Azure:
I remember mention in both the Calendar and Feature sections of the Seattle Weekly, as well as some passing comment on local news broadcasts (not that the local news holds any water whatsoever). I don't know that the Weekly archive goes back that far on their webpage, but I'll try to access it.
2599. AzureNW - Sep. 10, 1998 - 6:36 PM PDT
Thanks! I can't think of any reason other than the cost of putting such a production together that the Codex couldn't be shown again, at least in the same venue.
Here is the PI's special section on the show:
Leonardo Lives
2600. labarjare - Sep. 10, 1998 - 6:37 PM PDT
for guy who doesn't watch tv or listen to radio you know a lot about whats out there, Mondaugen. (g - for the hell of it.)
2601. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:00 PM PDT
I heard an interview with Peter Brook on NPR -- you know, the Balto-Brit who directed Marat/Sade, Shakespeare's Waiting for Lear and that 87-billion-hour stage adaptation of the Mahabharata. (The first hour of which I had the misfortune of being coerced by my then girlfriend to go see at BAM. I knew that when a bunch of Polish, and Japanese and Ghanaian mimes were acting out padded fairly tales from Mumbo-Jumbo-Land, heading for the nearest saloon would be the better option.)
Of course Brook was exactly as I expected: posturing, pretentious, precious and devoid of serious artistic substance. He actually said that at his "Institute for Theatre Research" (reminds me of the Institute for Creation Research) "technique is deemphasised" in favour of "sensitivity". Well, that's all you need, the fraudulence & delusion of the "Method" mixed in with a Marjoribankian congerie of international thespian brotherhood where no words are spoken, and all is mimed.
2602. labarjare - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:03 PM PDT
heading for the nearest saloon when at BAM takes some creative planning.
say - have you seen Brook's Don Giovanni?
2603. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:06 PM PDT
And he was babbling for 10 minutes about how in the West people's bodies are "ruined" early on for acting, whereas the culture of bowing in, say, Japan is perfect for the physical formation of supple actors. Brook actually seems to think that pupils in Japan bow 100 times a day at school and become Uberschauspieler in the process. But, then, of course, Brook's idea of dramaturgic bravura is probably that that androgyne clown who played the Fool in Kurosawa's "Ran".
2604. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:20 PM PDT
No, I didn't see Brook's Don Giovanni. Given that he has reduced Shakespeare to Beckett, did he also reduce Mozart to Pederastecki?
2605. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:24 PM PDT
Perhaps Muskrat Al-Fatah Khan rendered Don Giovanni.
2606. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:28 PM PDT
Imagine ululating "Finch'an del vino".
2607. labarjare - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:29 PM PDT
No, he actually left the music alone. But...you wouldn't have enjoyed the performance.
He also did a terrific Cosi.
2608. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:33 PM PDT
Cosi??? Are you referring to your caterpillar-browed mistress Cosima? Or are you referring to "Così fan tutte", the opera?
Of course the fool left the music alone. If he insisted on "sensitivity" and "no technique", the string section would have revolted.
2609. glendajean - Sep. 10, 1998 - 7:35 PM PDT
Brooks reduced "Carmen." It becomes Carmen and Don Jose in a circle of sand. Saves on cigarette factory overhead.
2610. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 11, 1998 - 12:36 AM PDT
I'll simply assume that Brooks' Gurdjieff biopic (based on "Interviews With Remarkable Men") isn't up to proverbial par?
2611. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 3:41 PM PDT
I had a random thought which possibly merits sharing with the arts thread regulars. I think my taste in women is relatively catholic -- I am indifferent between the "minceur ethiopique" and the classical amplitude of flesh. But I realised the upper bound on that amplitude is definitely exemplified by an Ingrès at the Met. I don't recall the name, but it's the one that should be called "Odalisque with a Big Shiny Butt Set to Maximum Advantage".
2612. phillipdavid - Sep. 12, 1998 - 3:56 PM PDT
PE,
I found this Ingres which shows a big shiny butt, but it is not shown off to maximum advantge, imo.
2613. cllrdr - Sep. 12, 1998 - 4:15 PM PDT
Pseudo -- Did you know that Brook made three different movies of his bargain-basement "Tragedie de Carmen"? The difference? Each was edited ever so slightly different from the other.
Like a lot of directors of his ilk (Robert Wilson being the most egregious example) Brook is a confectioner of the better ideas of others. Sometimes this works. I saw "Marat/Sade" live in New York and it was excellent. The excellence, I later came to understand, issued primarily from Adrian Mitchell's translation and the performances of Glenda Jackson and Patrick Magee.
2614. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 4:16 PM PDT
Oh, no, that's the super-ultra-famous Odalisque. The one at the Met is standing, head & backed turned to the viewer, and it's not as famous. And, boy, is the butt all too conspicuous.
2615. cllrdr - Sep. 12, 1998 - 4:18 PM PDT
BTW, Pseudo -- The Odalisque look is back thanks to Kate Winslet and (yikes!) THAT WOMAN!
2616. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 4:30 PM PDT
Actually, if I had to personify "minceur ethiopique" and "classical amplitude of flesh", it would be Kate Moss and Kate Winslet.
And, no, Kate Winslet is hardly Ingrès's Odalisque. She doesn't look capable of callipygian pregnancy.
As for Marat/Sade, I think the translation is pretty irrelevant. It's pretty simple & stark verbiage.
Magee is probably reincarnated from Sade, so that's hardly an accomplishment! The underrated one is Ian Richardson as Marat.
Glenda Jackson! I worship that titaness. There was some movie with her and George Segal, where they played adulterers in Gibraltar. I must say, Jackson is no beauty, but there is something about her which makes you believe that men would just flip for her.
2617. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 12, 1998 - 5:24 PM PDT
Azure:
From your PI link:
"After the tour, the Codex will go to Gates' Medina home, where a
custom-designed and climate-controlled vault has been created for its
storage. The Codex will spend most of its time there, in darkness as
complete as the darkness it enjoyed in its trunk in Rome. When Gates
wishes to view it, he'll do so only for brief periods and under regulated light conditions."
Not exactly a shoebox under his bed, but still...Unfortunately, the Weekly's archive doesn't go back that far, after all, but I maintain that there was mention of the fact that the Codex won't be touring again. At least anytime remotely soon.
2618. marjoribanks - Sep. 12, 1998 - 5:29 PM PDT
I'd like to nominate Pseuder's lines about Glenda Jackson , including the bits about 'falling for her' as among the strangest,least comprehensible things I have ever read on the Fray.
2619. cllrdr - Sep. 12, 1998 - 5:58 PM PDT
Now really marjoribanks -- chaque a son gout.
The most anti-Glenda Jackson remark I ever heard was vouchsafed to me by Gary Oldman, who I interviewed several years ago between marriages and rehab bouts: "I wouldn't piss in her ear if her brains were on fire."
As Auntie Mame would say, "How vivid."
2620. marjoribanks - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:01 PM PDT
In any case, though I find the remarks touching and quite revealing, my brother-in-law's neanderthal (mouseless!) computer is getting on my nerves and I'm going to go play with my godchild instead of wrestling with it.
2621. marjoribanks - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:03 PM PDT
CLLDR,
'gout' is all fine, but Glenda Jackson? The labour MP for Hampstead? And 'understanding' why men 'fall' for her? Really, it reads like a bad 60's script.
2622. marjoribanks - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:06 PM PDT
In the interest of accuracy, i should note that Pseuder said 'flip' not 'fall' , which actually makes his statement more heinous.
2623. marjoribanks - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:07 PM PDT
Love that Oldman quote BTW.
2624. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:12 PM PDT
Well, I was referring to her performance with George Segal in the movie whose name I can't recall. Clearly, the woman TODAY is a hag, a socialist hag who probably helps fund Hamas. But I thought she was rather attractive, in an ultra-English roseate sort of way, as Charlotte Corday. Didn't she also play Queen Elizabeth with Vanessda Redgrave as Mary of Scotland? And Jackson in that film Stevie was STUPENDOUS. I've been trying to decide for years which performance I like better, Jackson in Stevie or Vanessa Redgrave in Wetherby.
2625. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:14 PM PDT
Well, given that Oldman will most likely die unremembered, I'd say Jackson doesn't need his extinguisher.
2626. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:14 PM PDT
What has he done that's good since that Orton biopic?
2627. cllrdr - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:19 PM PDT
Pseudo -- The Glenda Jackson/George Segal movie you're thinking of is "A Touch of Class" (1973) for which she won her second Oscar.
2628. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:26 PM PDT
Pseud:
Well, despite a few glaringly major flaws, his directoral debut "Nil By Mouth" was pretty good. At least compared to the cruise-control of his acting jobs over the past few years.
2629. resonance - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:28 PM PDT
For some reason I keep getting Judi Dench and Glenda Jackson confused.
Which, I must add, had me rolling on the chair in long moments of unfounded yet powerful mirth just a few minutes ago.
2630. coralreef - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:43 PM PDT
Message #2626
Oldman's performances in True Romance and State of Grace were the best thing about those films, imo.
2631. coralreef - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:45 PM PDT
Which is not to contradict what KM said. He *has* been on autopilot in recent years. (Lost in Space? The Fifth Element? Air Force One? I mean, he's got to pay the bills but sheesh)
2632. PseudoErasmus - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:46 PM PDT
Oldman is nothing more than a collection of effects and superficies, a more frenetic version of Daniel Day-Lewis.
2633. cllrdr - Sep. 12, 1998 - 6:53 PM PDT
Forget about Lewis and Oldham. The new Brit to watch is Daniel Craig. His performance as George Dyer in "Love is the Devil" (John Maybury's Francis Bacon biopic) is the greatest debut I've seen since Doris Day in "Romance On the High Seas."
You heard it here first, folks.
2634. wabbit - Sep. 12, 1998 - 9:48 PM PDT
Wow, a hot tag...just goes to show what a little discussion about big shiny butts will do for a thread.
2635. coralreef - Sep. 12, 1998 - 10:06 PM PDT
You said it. A Touch of Ass was all it took. [waits for groans]
btw, Philistine - thanks for the earlier comments on the article.
2636. AzureNW - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:24 PM PDT
Some very large women are strikingly beautiful. It's interesting that strong singers are often extra-large. This weekend I watched a live telecast of Jessye Norman of the Metropolitan Opera performing two Wagner “songs” (or whatever segments of opera are called) as part of a inaugural presentation of the opening of Benaroya Hall, the new home of the Seattle Symphony, in downtown Seattle. She is a very large woman who I think is indisputably beautiful.
2637. trouserPilot - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:25 PM PDT
I want to go on record as objecting to PseudoErasmus' pedophilic slur against K. Penderecki.
2638. AzureNW - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:28 PM PDT
She makes some *very* strange faces while she is singing, though. Weirder than Anthony Kiedis.
2639. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:29 PM PDT
tp:
CofJ!
2640. AzureNW - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:34 PM PDT
Hi, KurtMondaugen.
What do you think of Benaroya Hall? I would imagine it will be an excellent venue for the kinds of odd sounds concerts you enjoy. Did you see the telecast of the premier on Saturday evening? I would like to post a note about it in the Music thread and ask a few questions about the music later, if I can stay organized enough today.
2641. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:44 PM PDT
Benaroya Hall is marginally interesting for the fact that the architects actually paid attention to and knew a little about the acoustical properties necessary for a successful hall (all too rare a thing), and for the 45-foot Rauschenberg in the lobby. It would be an excellent venue for contemporary music, but Gerard Schwarz tends to avoid contemporary programming as if it were a venereal disease. On this year's schedule, there is one program featuring a Lucio Berio piece along with Webern and the requisite Stravinsky, but other than that there's no 20thC representation at all. Of course, they've gotta pay for their spanky new hall, and subscribers will only come to hear the same old warhorses dragged out again and again, so that's not likely to change anytime in the next 5 to 10 years. Ptui.
2642. AzureNW - Sep. 14, 1998 - 12:55 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen -
It sounds like Benaroya will alleviate a lot of scheduling problems that existed with the overused Opera House, so I have hope that there will be more of all kinds of music in Seattle now. The musicians were *estactic* with the acoustical properties of the hall. The telecast audio was extremely good also, I think. It was a North American premeir of a kind of HDTV technology. You could almost hear people swallowing at times.
(please forgive the lack of spell checking. I give up on extacxtitk.)
2643. AzureNW - Sep. 14, 1998 - 2:47 PM PDT
KurtMondaugen -
Did you see Jonathan Larson's "Rent" at the Moore? Do you think it is worth seeing?
2644. labarjare - Sep. 14, 1998 - 7:14 PM PDT
wabbit - check your e-mails re tomorrow.
2645. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 14, 1998 - 9:49 PM PDT
Azure:
From what I've heard about "Rent", I can safely say with all authority that I don't think it's worth seeing.
2646. coralreef - Sep. 14, 1998 - 10:06 PM PDT
btw, a Picasso was on that SwissAir flight. "The Painter". I'm not familiar with it, but I get the impression it was not one of his most famous or important. Still, a loss. Paling beside the lives lost, but a loss nonetheless.
2647. adrianne - Sep. 17, 1998 - 5:38 AM PDT
Who SAYS you can't find good help anymore?
2648. JustSayYo - Sep. 17, 1998 - 6:40 AM PDT
Dang, common sense is such a gift isn't it?
2649. labarjare - Sep. 21, 1998 - 7:39 PM PDT
Well, this will be a sort of series of No Comment comments. There is a brief article in this week's New Yorker about the current whereabouts and fate of Richard Serra's terrific series of "massive steel sculptures" called "Torqued Ellipses". Each of these consist of "two high, curved walls of steel, each wall measuring about twenty feet by thirty feet". Those of you with relatively long memories will recall that these were on exhibit at the DIA Center here in NYC for several months until this past June when they were moved (that must have been something to put together) to LA where they are currently on exhibit at MOCA. Each of these has extraordinary lines and angles and textures and you can go inside them which creates a whole different set of lines, angles and textures.
Well, one of them has been purchased by Joel Silver (producer of Die Hard and the Lethal Weapon movies),who is going to put it in the grounds of a house he and his fiancee Karyn Fields are building in Brentwood. I quote: "The couple are already considering the ways in which the sculpture may enhance their marital life. 'The Serra show is very sexy,' says Fields. 'There is something really kind of erotic about it. When we were there looking at it, everyone was saying, "What are you going to do IN IT, Karyn (EMPHASIS ADDED). It makes you think of all these things you want to try in it. I can definitely nude-sunbathe in there and nobody can see me."
I continue in quote: "Silver says he's heard that the enormous Serra sculpture in the Guggenheim Museum in Bilbao has been used for even more unconventional purposes. 'I was told that they keep finding condoms in the Serra in Bilbao, which means that it is extremely (IN ITALICS) sexy,". He concludes, however, "They won't find them in the one in our house, though."
2650. labarjare - Sep. 21, 1998 - 7:40 PM PDT
Well, this will be a sort of series of No Comment comments. There is a brief article in this week's New Yorker about the current whereabouts and fate of Richard Serra's terrific series of "massive steel sculptures" called "Torqued Ellipses". Each of these consist of "two high, curved walls of steel, each wall measuring about twenty feet by thirty feet". Those of you with relatively long memories will recall that these were on exhibit at the DIA Center here in NYC for several months until this past June when they were moved (that must have been something to put together) to LA where they are currently on exhibit at MOCA. Each of these has extraordinary lines and angles and textures and you can go inside them which creates a whole different set of lines, angles and textures.
Well, one of them has been purchased by Joel Silver (producer of Die Hard and the Lethal Weapon movies),who is going to put it in the grounds of a house he and his fiancee Karyn Fields are building in Brentwood. I quote: "The couple are already considering the ways in which the sculpture may enhance their marital life. 'The Serra show is very sexy,' says Fields. 'There is something really kind of erotic about it. When we were there looking at it, everyone was saying, "What are you going to do IN IT, Karyn (EMPHASIS ADDED). It makes you think of all these things you want to try in it. I can definitely nude-sunbathe in there and nobody can see me."
I continue in quote: "Silver says he's heard that the enormous Serra sculpture in the Guggenheim Museum in Bilbao has been used for even more unconventional purposes. 'I was told that they keep finding condoms in the Serra in Bilbao, which means that it is extremely (IN ITALICS) sexy,". He concludes, however, "They won't find them in the one in our house, though."
2651. labarjare - Sep. 21, 1998 - 7:41 PM PDT
Yes. A bit more. The article also confirms what had been reported here in NYC some months ago. Leonard Riggio, of Barnes & Noble fame and ownership, has purchased several (I had thought all but obviously not)of these beauties for permanent display at the DIA. (They really aren't made for on loan purposes.) The article also says that he has commissioned a new Serra for his pad in the Hamptons where it will take several acres.
Yes again.
2652. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 21, 1998 - 9:45 PM PDT
Lab:
It'd be interesting to hear what the paid artist has to say about pigs rutting among his work. Key word there being 'paid'.
Don't get me wrong, I like Serra, I just think an academic essay justifying on bourgeoise sex-acts corrupting and/or contributing to his work would be a funny thing to read.
2653. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 21, 1998 - 9:47 PM PDT
please remove the word "on" from the last paragraph of the above post. Sometimes a 30-foot piece of steel is just a 30-foot piece of steel.
2654. wabbit - Sep. 22, 1998 - 1:04 AM PDT
LabJ,
Thank you.
Labj and KM,
A missive from Serra would be fun, I hope someone sends him the article. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he approved of the carryings on with his work, it isn't macho for nothing. Just wait until one of those big steel walls falls over on some unbalanced pair.
2655. wabbit - Sep. 22, 1998 - 1:09 AM PDT
Several Mondays back, I met the Mondaugens and the Labarjares at MOMA. You haven't lived until you have been through a Kusama exhibit with this group. What a treat! We met with the Tmacs chez Labj for what was billed as a light supper. HA! Mr. Tmac recited the better part of “The Worst Job I Ever ‘ad” and we missed the opportunity of getting Mondaugen to play the piano for us (he actually hits the keys and produces sounds). Good wine, good food and good company. I got home at 3am. Much thanks to the Labarjares.
I have been hoping Mondaugen would post his impressions of the Kusama and Rodchenko exhibits, along with a book review of the fuzzy Kusama catalog. Meanwhile, I'll say a bit about Bonnard. I have gathered some images together (and scanned a few I couldn't find on the web). My apologies for the pixilated images – those aren't my scans, and I was too lazy to rescan each image.
Bonnard's paintings fall into two groups for me: when he's on, the work is interesting, conveying intimacy and transcending decorative patterns and color, but when he's off, the paintings are merely pretty at best. The trick is to decide which is which, and give the ones you are drawn to time to dawn on you, because it is easy to dismiss all of Bonnard's work as merely pretty. My unfortunate housemate lost patience and shrugged all the way through.
Let's start with the horrors.
2656. wabbit - Sep. 22, 1998 - 1:12 AM PDT
A while back, I mentioned my intense dislike for what I called Bonnard's acidic yellow. Bonnard didn't start by overusing this color, but he sure got around to it. “Woman in a Dressing Gown” from 1914 is one of the early offenders, but the two standouts are “Café ‘Au Petit Poucet'”, 1928, and “Large Yellow Nude”, 1931. You should see these in person to fully appreciate just how atrocious this yellow is. Touches of it here and there are one thing, as in “…Dressing Gown”, but the YN is truly too much. Let me say that I can enjoy all three of these paintings just fine compositionally, and Bonnard's color choices were usually excellent, but that color makes me shudder.
While on the subject of LYN, take a look at the lower right corner. See the pair of purple hands? Can you figure out what they are holding? This is a topic of much discussion among artists, curators and historians. The painter Eric Fischl thinks it is a bloody menstrual cloth. I think Mr. Fischl needs to pay closer attention to his wife. Anyway, it makes for some lively speculation and points out how carefully one needs to look at many of Bonnard's canvasses. He likes to disguise things around the edges. The more time you spend looking at some of the paintings, the more you will see, not only subject-wise, but you begin to notice how Bonnard is playing with perspective and focus, and how he moves your eye around the canvas.
2657. wabbit - Sep. 22, 1998 - 1:21 AM PDT
My pick for worst painting in the show is “The Earthly Paradise.” This one got completely away from Bonnard, as if his brush decided to go off on its own. The effect is that the painting seems unresolved, as if it reached a point of no return. The marks are just there on the canvas, with no coherence, and only the figure of Eve seems to have held any interest for Bonnard. This is one of four commissioned paintings, and was evidently meant to be decorative, but it doesn't work at all for me.
“Siesta” and “Man and Woman,” both 1900, show Bonnard still using the muted colors he borrowed from Cezanne, but the voyeuristic intimacy he will eventually be known for is apparent. Repetition and pattern, psychologically composed spaces, it all shows up over and over throughout Bonnard's career.
I don't have the energy right now to get into the bathtub paintings in depth, but isn't there something just a bit perverse with a man who paints his wife soaking in the bath over and over again, after his mistress has committed suicide by drowning herself in the bath? No matter, the bathtub paintings are beautiful. Bonnard puts the two women together in a few paintings (it was a cozy arrangement, they did know each other and spent time together). In “After the Meal,” Bonnard's mistress is the woman standing in the doorway at the far left of the canvas, watching Bonnard's wife clear the table.
And now I have run out of steam for discussing Bonnard, so I will skip the landscapes, the self-portraits and the still life paintings, though I did post one still life just because I love the red tablecloth and that Mr. PotatoHead thing he has going on with the fruit arrangement. Labj, care to carry on?
2658. CoRaLrEeF - Sep. 22, 1998 - 3:12 AM PDT
My uneducated guess is that the hands are simply holding out a towel for her. Yes, the cloth is purply-red but so are the hands, and I doubt that's an accurate portrayal of how his hands looked, so the color is a red herring. It looks like it was put in simply for compositional balance, both geometrically and colorwise. You could also say it adds emotional balance, as it gives evidence of life in the room other than her. Looking at his other paintings, there is life around the subjects and he may have felt it was too stark without that addition.
But as I've never SEEN a Bonnard up close, I'll shut up now.
2659. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 22, 1998 - 7:49 AM PDT
wabbit:
The MOMA visit was great fun, indeed. We saw so much stuff while we were in NY that I wanted to assimilate most of it before writing too much (though I did comment on the Whiteread a few posts back). I'll be back to talk about the Kusama show and a few other things probably before the weekend.
2660. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 22, 1998 - 7:52 AM PDT
Although I can say with some regret that one thing we did *not* get to see was marjoribanks' recently acquired Souza collection. How's that website coming, marj?
2661. marjoribanks - Sep. 23, 1998 - 8:09 AM PDT
Shhhhh.
Mondaugen, I will e-mail you (and any others interested) the URL in two weeks when the site is launched. I have been advised for , um, various reasons not to identify myself as the 'owner' of this rather embarrassingly large and rich collection so please play along.
2662. KurtMondaugen - Sep. 23, 1998 - 8:13 AM PDT
natch.
2663. marjoribanks - Sep. 23, 1998 - 8:19 AM PDT
Anyway, here's a silly little watercolor by the man in question which brought a large sum at the last Christie's Indian Art auction. Wait till the webpage is up to see just how great the man's stuff can be.
2664. senecio - Sep. 23, 1998 - 8:57 AM PDT
Quite engaging, if I may interject... Assuming that's a palette he holds in his hand and not a graduation hat, that self-depicting pose has, of course a long history, including Velazquez, Chagall, Modigliani et. al. Can't wait to see more of this guy's art
2665. marjoribanks - Sep. 23, 1998 - 9:05 AM PDT
Thanks for your comments senecio. And thanks for posting here again, this lurker misses your posts.
I'm going to hold off discussing my favorite artist until I have lots of images to show around but was touched by your comments. The piece I linked was meant to be fairly amusing I think, while whimsically placing the artist (he was in Paris at the time) in a pantheon of great moderns. It is quite engaging as you sayl, but his serious work is truly compelling. Watch this space at the end of next week for some REAL eye-candy.
2666. cyrusk - Sep. 23, 1998 - 5:20 PM PDT
Attention Fraygrants:
Due to a site upgrade this evening, Fraygrants will be unable to post messages to The Fray for one hour beginning at 9 p.m. PT. I hope this doesn't inconvenience you, but it's necessary. Sorry for such short notice.
Cyrus Krohn
Managing Editor, SLATE
2667. DaveCook - Sep. 25, 1998 - 5:25 AM PDT
I went to the National Palace Museum in Taiwan. My impressions:
1) Given the scale of construction in Taipei and the scale of museums in other cities and the scale of the collection of the NP Museum, they should really just tear down the whole musem and build something much larger so they could show more of their collection. (The NP museum has the best collection of Chinese art in the world. 5000 years of civilization, they should conciously look to compete with the Met or the Louvre or the Hermitage).
2) Chinese art seems to downplay the Old Master thing which seems so important in Western art. It is thus very hard to get a grasp on the evolution of the art without a careful understanding of the evolution of the particular dynasties (exacerbated no doubt by the fact that art was directed toward the taste of the occasional emporer actually interested in art).
2) The scale of the museum
2668. DaveCook - Sep. 25, 1998 - 5:36 AM PDT
3) The exhibit of curio boxes was fascinating. If I could have brought a folding chair to the museum, I would have moved it around from display case to display case to examine each one of these boxes. During the Ming, but especially the Qing dynasty, the mandarin would have a curio box, full of ornate objects, pens and little bells and such that they would carry around with them. For a shambling gwei lo such as myself, this whole mind set was so alien (I can barely remember to tuck in my golf shirt, much less carry around a collection of beautiful, delicate objects to alleviate the ugliness of life) and yet so delicate as to stimulate a feeling reminiscent of actual nostalgia. Obviously, I have no sentimental memories of my time as a mandarin in the Qing dynasty, but I was indeed struck by this feeling of sentimental memory (of course, myself a mandarin, but still). This feeling was exactly like my time in the south wing of the second floor of the Art Institute in Chicago, examining their excellent collection of Cornell's. Each a little box redolent with someone else's memory.
2669. DaveCook - Sep. 25, 1998 - 5:37 AM PDT
4) The Chinese food at the restaurant is great.
2670. JustSayYo - Sep. 25, 1998 - 9:54 PM PDT
This is most excellent. Thanks Dave and Marj.
2671. pseudoerasmus - Sep. 26, 1998 - 12:02 AM PDT
An explication-on-the-fly of F.N. Souza's Self-Portrait:
010 home
020 ----#pastiche template---
030 v_background = "chagall","1912"
040 v_attire = "duke of wellington pantaloons","sinbad vest"
050 v_face="christ","icon","andrei roublev"
060 v_objet="mortarboard","léger"
080 ---#mortarboard=palette---
090 end
2672. ScottLoar - Sep. 26, 1998 - 5:35 AM PDT
DaveCook, actually I find the curio cabinets (not always boxes) of the Chinese gentry one of the objects most echoed in the West by the curio cabinets of the European bourgeoise in the 17th century. I find the National Palace Museum already gargantuan (I can't imagine the buildings or grounds becoming larger than they are), and some of the collections -especially Ming blue and white ware - overkill on a grand scale. A little blue and white goes a long way. I compare that gargantuan and confusing scale to the permanent and understandable display of Chinese arts exhibited at the new Shanghai Museum in comfortable, sympathetic surroundings, showing and explaining the variances in forms and materials from dynasty to dynasty.
2673. ScottLoar - Sep. 26, 1998 - 5:41 AM PDT
I do like your notion of "sentimental memory", for some objects seem to speak to us from time. If this sounds completely nuts or hopelessly affected I'm reminded of that character tough guy Edward G. Robinson who admitted visiting his collection and listening to the art speak.
2674. ScottLoar - Sep. 26, 1998 - 5:58 AM PDT
The collection in Taipei is the imperial collection, more or less intact from the time of the Ch'ien-lung Emperor with later additions, and is the largest, grandest display of Chinese art in the world. If you can get through it all.
A surprising display of Chinese ceramics is in Jakarta where a museum displays the bequeathed collection of one Dutch collector. As the works of individual collectors these smaller collections often show a wealth of good taste, the best of the best. And easy to get through it all.
2675. marjoribanks - Sep. 28, 1998 - 8:24 AM PDT
I have a feeling that post 2671 is quite clever.
2676. wabbit - Sep. 30, 1998 - 10:38 PM PDT
Has anyone seen the exhibit of late Monet paintings in Boston?