Takeout X Vs Negative X

 

by: sage10606 (56/M/White Plains N.Y.)

Bid - X = Takeout. Bid - Bid - X = negative. Bid - X - Bid - X may be either depending on if you are playing responsive X. Bid - Bid - Bid - X = penalty unless you are playing support X (showing 3 card support with an honor).

Another post stated that you are not likely to reap a profit doubling opponents when they have found a fit. I fully agree with that statement if you are in the habit of overcalling with crap just to hear yourself bid or if you have no clue on how to defend a hand.

During my competitive years I have insisted that my partner have 10+HCP or AK in suit with 9HCP , anything less, preempt the hand or pass. Using sound overcalls I have scored many +300's doubling opponents 2 and 3 level bids when the best we can do is make a partial. An overcall promises (or should) 1 1/2 defensive tricks the same as an opening bid promises 2 1/2 defensive tricks. Preempts were developed to bid hands that do not meet this requirement. If I can trust my partner to have their overcall and I have 9-10 hcp we have 1/2 the points available neither side is going to make game(not counting unusual distribution).75-80% of the time you will set the opponents for more then your partial. If you are only going to double for penalty when you are sure of a set you are not doubling enough. This applies to duplicate bridge only. There IS a different approach when playing rubber bridge. Double only when sure of setting. The penalties for failure are too severe. I have a view that if my side has 1/2 the points and 3 suits then the opponents are not making their bid on 1 suit and the other 1/2 without a lot of helpful distribution.

Using the hand described (xxx K AKxx Jxxxx) 2S is not likely to make. Double and lead trumps every time your in. Your partner knows you do not have 4S(you would have bid them) and if partner does not wish to defend he/she will bid again and you will get to where you belong. I take the view that 3C in this sequence is forcing to game some where.

 

sage on doubles - rebuttal

by: blumblum98 (M/colorado)

Sage: It was my post that said most good players play the sequence One heart, one spade two hearts double as takeout. I stand by that statement. I didn't say all good players, and I think from your posts you are a good player, and if you play it that way fine. I think the reason most people play that way is that they didn't get good results from defending against two level bids when the opponents have an eight card fit or higher, partly based on total tricks reasoning, and partly historically because for every 100 they got for setting, the field was making 110 or 140. There are some 200 available but also some minus 590. Partly also people today overcall lighter than you require for various reasons, mainly because they think they can prevent hands from being stolen from them. The result was that other uses were found for the double besides penalty.

I also said it was nonsense to say that any time your partner has bid a double by you is penalty. I stand by that also. I chose one sequence to illustrate it, Maybe not the best. Here is another.

One club on your right, one heart by you, one spade on your left, two hearts by partner, two spades on your right, Double by you. I believe this shows an opening bid in hearts, but not the right shape to double one club, for example xx AQJxxx AQx xx.

Your partner has supported you so you have probably a nine card fit, the opponents have probably an eight card fit, how can this be a penalty double? This is a corollary to the law of total tricks. Your double tells partner you have an opening bid so he can judge the auction. It is not for penalty even though partner has bid.

There are other sequences reopening doubles, optional doubles etc. where you have to judge the total sequence, not whether or not partner bid or if it is your second or third turn to bid.

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