Date: Fri Aug 20 16:37:28 1999 From: InfidelsRe@aol.com Subject: LISH Newsletter part 1If you wish to be deleted from this mailing list, please email us. Sorry for any inconvenience we may have caused. Comments and suggestions encouraged.
INQUIRER, August, 1999, Volume 2, Issue 8
Long Island Secular Humanists Box 119, Greenlawn, NY 11740 Email InfidelsRe@aol.com
Visit LISH on the web @ http://wwwhumanist.com and also at http://www.homestead.com/unofficial_lish
A Thumbs Up Publication Editor: Gerald D Ar Design: John W
LISH MEETING INFORMATION Meetings will resume in the fall with outstanding guest speakers, including Warren Allen Smith (on Friday, November 19) who is a contributor to Free Inquiry magazine and author of the soon to be released "Who's Who in Hell," a freethought compilation. Also scheduled is Ron Barrier on Friday, September 17, spokesperson for American Atheists and a WCW referee, and author and singer-songwriter actvist Sandy Rapp on Friday, October 15, for an evening of music and talk. Meetings are held at the Plainview-Old Bethpage Public Library, 999 Old Country Road, Plainview @ 7:15 PM.
Contents: The Ten Commandments Issue By Gerry D The Commandments Up Close By Gabriel E The New, Improved Standard Ten Commandments and G. W. Bush By Gerry D Kiss Hank's Ass By Anonymous via the Internet Letters To The Editor
SECULAR HUMANISM is the philosophy of life guided by reason and science, freed from religious and secular dogmas, motivated by an appreciation of life and the lives of others, seeking to reach goals of human happiness, freedom and understanding on this earth, in this life.
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The Ten Commandments Issue By Gerry D The Ten Commandments tower over western morality like almost no other concept. They are purported to be absolute and wise by those who support the concept. Indeed, the religious right is blaming the lack of faith in these commandments for the ills of society, most notably school violence. They seek to have public schools post these commandments for students to see and, supposedly, improve their morality. The US House of Representatives has passed a law enacting this and have passed other laws promoting religion awaiting approval by the Senate. Aside from the obvious unconstitutionality of the proposed laws, is there any merit in the argument that the Ten Commandments will improve morals? As an ethical paradigm, the Ten Commandments mostly serve an omnipotent being who lacks nothing yet demands obedience! The few human oriented commands are simplistic, incomplete and in some cases, malevolent. If we want to instill values in the young, we should, obviously, instill those values. Do we instead really want to teach our children "thou shalt have no other gods before me"? Isn't this the point of ethnic cleansing, persecutions, crusades, inquisitions and many wars? What is possibly wrong with promoting honesty, integrity, benevolence and inquiry for the good effect they will have on our lives? Yet the zealously religious will not allow such ethics to be taught without god commanding them. This linking of god and morality reduces morality to nothing more than reward and punishment, with the convenient loophole of repentance and salvation for mere belief. Promoting ethics is its own end: it is its own reward. Life would be better in a kind and honest world, would it not? For those who cannot cooperate and instead actually harm others, we have the remedy of earthly justice and prison. Rather than divide school children with an intolerant and unreasonable religious code of obedience, let us promote the common decencies which people of all religions and beliefs cherish for the sake of the decencies themselves. We need no god to command us to do this.
The Commandments Up Close By Gabriel E So the Christians want to put the Ten Commandments in public schools do they? They claim that the Ten Commandments are the source of morality do they? Well, first of all, why should we have quotations from a Judeo-Christian book? Why not the book of Thai or Baghavad Ghitta. What makes Christianity the religion that should be forced on all kids in public schools no matter what religion they might belong to or even if they do not belong to a religion? Why should all taxpayers be force to support a particular religion? However, aside from that fact there is something else that the Christians are ignoring. When the Christians say that the Ten Commandments are the source of morality they are dead wrong. They are obviously either delusional or they have never read the Ten Commandments in the first place. Well, I have read them and guess what? Only 3 out of the Ten Commandments actually advocate morality and the other 7 Commandments have absolutely nothing to do with morality. Some of them even advocate the opposite of morality, and the 3 Commandments that do advocate morality have in no way originated with the Ten Commandments but had existed in cultures long before the Ten Commandments. To prove my point I will now write each commandment as it is written in the bible and I will comment on each one. Here goes. I Exodus 20:2-3. I am the Lord thy God, which has brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. MY COMMENTARY: First of all this commencement is clearly addressing those who came out of Egypt so what makes the Christians think it's addressing them? Also this commandment does not advocate morality in any way. Just how is it morally wrong to worship other gods? This commandment is clearly biased against other religions and if you read the bible you will notice that the Hebrews did slaughter nations for worshiping other gods. Also notice that in this commandment it's god who is speaking. You will see why I am pointing that out later. II Exodus 20:4-6. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them; for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me. And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my Commandments. MY COMMENTARY: Now thi commandment is a mouth full. Where do I start? First of all this commandment clearly does not advocate morality either. How is it morally wrong to make graven images? I guess all the artists are going straight to hell huh? Besides many Christians make them and also you will see them in any Catholic Church you will go into. Catholic Churches are loaded with statues and pictures. Also notice the reason for this commandment. It makes the god jealous. As you can see god himself admits to being the jealous type. Now what kind of a god is he if he gets jealous? In this commandment god also threatens to punish not only the transgressors but also the decedents of the transgressors unto the third or fourth generation. Now where is the justice in punishing the grand children for the wrong doings of their grand parents? Imagine if you were arrested because your father robbed a bank. This goes together with the concept of original sin where we get punished for something that Adam did. Besides it contradicts the part of the bible which says that children are not to be punished for the sins of their parents. Once again notice that in this commandment it's god himself who is speaking. III Exodus 20:7. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. MY COMMENTARY: This commandment does not advocate morality either. How is it morally wrong to say a certain word? Christians want this in a country that has freedom of speech? By the way remember when I pointed out that in the first two Commandments it was god speaking himself? You can tell that from the way it is written. Well, in this commandment it is someone else speaking and talking about god. Gee how did that happen? I wonder who really wrote the Commandments and why the writer is not consistent? IV Exodus 20:8-11. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thy labour, and do all thy work; but on the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For the Lord in six days made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is, and rested on the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it. MY COMMENTARY: This commandment does not advocate morality either. How is it morally wrong to work on a particular day of the week? Are you hurting somebody by it? Besides, how many Christians do you know that actually keep this commandment? Christians themselves disobey this one just like commandment two. Also why did god take 6 days to create the world? If he is all-powerful he should have taken but one moment. Also why did he need to rest on the seventh day? How is he all-powerful if he needed to rest? Also notice that in this commandment it's someone else other than god talking about god. V Exodus 20:12. Honour thy father nd thy mother: that thy days might be long upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee. MY COMMENTARY: First of all what land is it talking about? What land did god give us? Oh yes it's talking about Israel because if you notice in commandment one it's addressing people that god took out of Egypt and brought to Canaan AKA Israel which the Hebrews took over after slaughtering the nations there for worshiping other gods. Well, why should we obey this commandment in order for our days to be long in Israel if we are not in Israel? Most Christians are not in Israel. Even most Jews are not in Israel. But yet we are commended to do this so that our stay in Israel will be long? How is that possible? Besides why would I want to stay in Israel. I was there once and I like it here better. Now let me comment on the commandment itself. Sure it's a good idea if people honor each other but should children honor their parents even if the parents are abusive? This commandment has been used throughout the ages as an excuse for parents to abuse their children and enslave them and such. This commandment does not advocate morality. VI Exodus 20:13. Thou shalt not kill. MY COMMENTARY: This is one of the 3 Commandments that does advocate morality but it did not originate with the Ten Commandments. Cultures had laws against murder long before the Ten Commandments. VII Exodus 20:14. Thou shalt not commit adultery. MY COMMENTARY: This commandment does not advocate morality, it only interferes into people's families. Imagine if we lived in a country where cheating on your spouse was illegal and punishable. Besides if you read the entire Old Testament you will notice that it's OK for a man to have as many wives as he likes and chooses. The wives don't choose their husbands and can have only one, the one they belong to. Adultery just means that when a man has a relationship with some other man's wife, it's like stealing his property. Also if you will read the bible, if a mansuspects his wife of committing adultery he can take her to the temple and make her drink water mixed with ashes from the sacrificial alter. If she lives she is innocent and if she is poisoned she's guilty. There is no test for men to check if they committed adultery, and besides a man can choose any women he likes, just not the ones that already belong to someone else. VIII Exodus 20:15. Thou shalt not steal. MY COMMENTARY: This is the second of the 3 Commandments that do advocate morality but once again it did not originate with the Ten Commandments but had existed in cultures long before the Ten Commandments. IX Exodus 20:16. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor. MY COMMENTARY: This is the third of the three Commandments that advocates morality. At least you would not want anybody to defraud you in a court but again it did not originate with the Ten Commandments. X Exodus 20:17. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor anything that is thy neighbor's. MY COMMENTARY: This commandment does not in any way advocate morality. Now we all know what the word covet means. It means to be jealous. Just how is it morally wrong to be jealous of something that somebody else has? Are you hurting that person in any way? Jealousy is a natural human reaction. It's only a feeling and nobody even has to know you have it. Besides didn't god himself admit to being jealous in commandment two? We are commended not to be jealous by a jealous god. What a hypocrite!
The New, Improved Standard Ten Commandments & George W. Bush By Gerry D Who would ever have expected George W. Bush to come up with the idea of a generation? In the midst of the recent craze to post the Ten Commandments everywhere from public school walls, courts of laws to, possibly, bathroom tissue, the sticky question often arises of which Ten Commandments are the ones to be promoted! On the campaign trail, presidential aspirant Bush was asked that since he's in favor of the State promoting the Ten Commandments, how would it be decided which version to post? Well, unless I hallucinated this whole episode, (which is not impossible) George W. Bush, the likely Republican nominee in the upcoming presidential election, stated that he believes that, surely, we as a society can agree on a standard version of the Ten Commandments! Absolute genius! One wonders why Mr. Bush doesn't go all the way and suggest that as a society, hell, as the human race, we all agree on a standard religion! What a concept! What would be the aspects of this standard system of belief? Well I'm sure that Mr. Bush would insist that belief in Jesus Christ as everyone's personal savior would be a feature since he has stated that this is necessary for salvation (attention damned Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist and non-believer voters.) Unfortunately Mr. Bush hasn't fleshed all of his Ten Commandment ideas out, which is basically par for the course thus far in his presidential campaign. Like most good politicians and religions, the less said about the details, the better! If any reader has all of the details of Mr. Bush's comments on the subject, please forward them to us! In the meantime, LISH will do the heavy lifting for the would-be president, and would like to submit, for your consideration, the new and improved Standard Ten Commandments. Though this new and improved version is not claimed to be divinely inspired, we will leave it to others to "prove" it is not divinely inspired. It is not binding or absolute since one of the improved Commandments calls for unlimited inquiry on any matter, including the Commandments. Another improved feature of the Standard Ten Commandments is their neutral nature regarding gods. Although tolerance is not acceptable for many fundamentalist believers, it is hoped that others see the need for pluralism in order to live cooperatively in this life on this earth. What about "pedigree"? Well, since there are already any number of Ten Commandments recognized by different classes of persons, none of them verbatim translations of any original alleged scripture, and differing markedly from each other in substantive respects, any compilation of Commandments deserves judgement based on the merits, since heritage has proven irrelevant. If there is to be a fair public debate on the Ten Commandments, we believe that the new and improved Standard Ten Commandments would prevail. LISH seeks feedback on these proposed Ten Commandments from members, supporters and other humanist and non-humanist groups. If other groups wish to join in, we will let the public, the media and Congress understand we exist and we disagree with their presumptions. A goal will be to have the media publish these Commandments, every Congressperson to receive them, and if necessary, fight to have our Ten Commandments displayed in schools and other public places in the place of the, um, non-standard Ten Commandments. Here they are:
The Standard Ten Commandments We, the members of the human community speak these words, saying 1) We shall not limit freedom of thought 2) We shall not cause unnecessary harm to any living thing or the environment 3) We shall be respectful of the rights of others 4) We shall be honest 5) We shall be responsible for our actions 6) We shall be fair in all matters to all persons 7) We shall be consideate of the happiness and well being of others 8) We shall be reasonable in our actions 9) We shall nurture these values by word & deed in our children, family, friends and acquaintances 10) We shall not limit inquiring or testing by the nature of the consequences, on any matter, including these Commandments, LISH 1999
Our thanks to George W. Bush for inspiration and encouragement, I think. If you would like a copy (8 1/2" x 11") of the above commandments suitable for framing, send $1.50 to LISH, Box 119 Greenlawn, NY 11740 (free for LISH members).
Kiss Hank's Ass By Anonymous via the Internet This morning there was a knock at my door. When I answered the door I found a well-groomed, nicely dressed couple. The man spoke first. John: "Hi! I'm John, and this is Mary." Mary: "Hi! We're here to invite you to come kiss Hank's ass with us." Me: "Pardon me?! What are you talking about? Who's Hank, and why would I want to kiss his ass?" John: "If you kiss Hank's ass, he'll give you a million dollars; and if you don't, he'll kick the shit out of you." Me: "What? Is this some sort of bizarre mob shake-down?" John: "Hank is a billionaire philanthropist. Hank built this town. Hank owns this town. He can do what ever he wants, and what he wants is to give you a million dollars, but he can't until you kiss his ass." Me: "That doesn't make any sense. Why..." Mary: "Who are you to question Hank's gift? Don't you want a million dollars? Isn't it worth a little kiss on the ass?" Me: "Well maybe, if it's legit, but..." John: "Then come kiss Hank's ass with us." Me: "Do you kiss Hank's ass often?" Mary: "Oh, yes, all the time..." Me: "And has he given you a million dollars?" John: "Well, no, you don't actually get the money until you leave town." Me: "So why don't you just leave town now?" Mary: "You can't leave until Hank tells you to, or you don't get he money, and he kicks the shit out of you." Me: "Do you know anyone who kissed Hank's ass, left town, and got the million dollars?" John: "My mother kissed Hank's ass for years. She left town last year, and I'm sure she got the money." Me: "Haven't you talked to her since then?" John: "Of course not, Hank doesn't allow it." Me: "So what makes you think he'll actually give you the money if you've never talked to anyone who got the money?" Mary: "Well, he gives you a little bit before you leave. Maybe you'll get a raise, maybe you'll win a small lotto, maybe you'll just find a twenty dollar bill on the street." Me: "What's that got to do with Hank? John: "Hank has certain 'connections.'" Me: "I'm sorry, but this sounds like some sort of bizarre con game." John: "But it's a million dollars, can you really take the chance? And remember, if you don't kiss Hank's ass he'll kick the shit of you." Me: "Maybe if I could see Hank, talk to him, get the details straight from him..." Mary: "No one sees Hank, no one talks to Hank." Me: "Then how do you kiss his ass?" John: "Sometimes we just blow him a kiss, and think of his ass. Other times we kiss Karl's ass, and he passes it on." Me: "Who's Karl?" Mary: "A friend of ours. He's the one who taught us all about kissing Hank's ass. All we had to do was take him out to dinner a few times." Me: "And you just took his word for it when he said there was a Hank, that Hank wanted you to kiss his ass, and that Hank would reward you?" John: "Oh no! Karl's got a letter Hank sent him years ago explaining the whole thing. Here's a copy; see for yourself." John handed me a photocopy of a handwritten memo on "From the desk of Karl" letterhead. There were eleven items listed: 1.Kiss Hank's ass and he'll give you a million dollars when you leave town. 2.Use alcohol in moderation. 3.Kick the shit out of people who aren't like you. 4.Eat right. 5.Hank dictated this list himself. 6.The moon is made of green cheese. 7.Everything Hank says is right. 8.Wash your hands after going to the bathroom. 9.Don't drink. 10.Eat your wieners on buns, no condiments. 11.Kiss Hank's ass or he'll kick the shit out of you. Me: "This would appear to be written on Karl's letterhead." Mary: "Hank didn't have any paper." Me: "I have a hunch that if we checked we'd find this is Karl's handwriting." John: "Of course, Hank dictated it." Me: "I thought you said no one gets to see Hank?" Mary: "Not now, but years ago he would talk to some people." Me: "I thought you said he was a philanthropist. What sort of philanthropist kicks the shit out of people just because they're different?" Mary: "It's what Hank wants, and Hank's always right." Me: "How do you figure that?" Mary: "Item 7 says, 'Everything Hanks says is right.' That's good enough for me!" Me: "Maybe your friend Karl just made the whole thing up." John: "No way! Item 5 says, 'Hank dictated this list himself.' Besides, item 2 says, 'Use alcohol in moderation,' item 4 says, 'Eat right,' and item 8 says, 'wash your hands after going to the bathroom.' Everyone knows those things are right, so the rest must be true, too." Me: "But 9 says, 'Don't Drink,' which doesn't quite go with item 2, and 6 says, 'The moon is made of green cheese,' which is just plain wrong." John: "There's no contradiction between 9 and 2, 9 just clarifies 2. As far as 6 goes, you've never ben to the moon, so you can't say for sure." Me: "Scientists have pretty firmly established that the moon is made of rock..." Mary: "But they don't know if the rock came from the Earth, or from outer space, so it could just as easily be green cheese." Me: "I'm not really an expert, but I think the theory that the moon came from the Earth has been discounted. Besides, not knowing where the rock came from doesn't make it cheese." John: "Aha! You just admitted that scientists make mistakes, but we know Hank is always right!" Me: "We do?" Mary: "Of course we do, Item 5 says so." Me: "You're saying Hank's always right because the list says so, the list is right because Hank dictated it, and we know that Hank dictated it because the list says so. That's circular logic, no different than saying, 'Hank's right because he says he's right.'" John: "Now you're getting it! It's so rewarding to see someone come around to Hank's way of thinking." Me: "But...oh, never mind. What's the deal with wieners?" Mary blushes. John says: "Wieners, in buns, no condiments. It's Hank's way. Anything else is wrong." Me: "What if I don't have a bun?" John: "No bun, no wiener. A wiener without a bun is wrong." Me: "No relish? No Mustard?" Mary looks positively stricken. John shouts: "There's no need for such language! Condiments of any kind are wrong!" Me: "So a big pile of sauerkraut with some wieners chopped up in it would be out of the question?" Mary sticks her fingers in her ears: Mary: "I am not listening to this. La la la, la la, la la la." John: "That's disgusting. Only some sort of evil deviant would eat that..." Me: "It's good! I eat it all the time." Mary faints. John catches her. John: "Well, if I'd known you were one of those I wouldn't have wasted my time. When Hank kicks the shit out of you I'll be there, counting my money and laughing. I'll kiss Hank's ass for you, you bunless cut-wienered kraut-eater." With this, John dragged Mary t their waiting car, and sped off. T he end.
Letters to the Editor
Re: Question of the month: Should the state actively promote the biblical Ten Commandments as a moral guide? 7/99 No, absolutely no, or hell, no! From Kath, WitchWolfe, Anitra, Snuggle, Jimbo, and others via the Internet Don't straddle the fence now guys! G.D.
7/26/99 How about demanding the First Ten Amendments to the constitution be posted in every public official's office and in legislative/judicial chambers? Larry Reyka, Humanist Chaplain, via Internet What are you, un-American? G.D.
7/26/99 No doubt about itthe Ten Commandments was a great movie. Charlton Heston's stone-like bad acting is an example to all NY state drama students. Also, cinema history classes will benefit from seeing this film. Any state that doesn't condone the screening of this film is clearly living in an age of moral decay. Sincerely, Rex Castingcouch, a.k.a. Scott M., Huntington, NY I've been searching for the missing Commandment "gunliness is next to godliness." Have you seen it? G.D.
7/26/99 Only 4 of the Ten Commandments deal with morality (lie, kill, steal, adultery.) The remaining Commandments deal with either arbitrary morality (i.e.; honoring parents) or simply promoting the supposed Judeo-Christian morality which is of course a DIRECT violation of the "establishment" clause of the first Amendment. The unthinking willingness for bible worshippers to abandon their Constitution in favor of attempting to force religion on the unwilling is frightening. MRue via Internet I t is amazing how they cannot see how the First Amendment protects them in case they become minority believers. People seem so willing to trade freedom for privilege. G.D.
7/26/99 Why certainly, and they should also teach how the Old Testament says that slavery, murder, and pillaging are really good moral things that have God's endorsement. If they want to actively promote biblical ideals they shouldn't do it in a selective way, they should include all the nasty, hateful, tribal stuff in the Old Testament. Harry the Happy Heretic via Internet Honesty might be too confusing! G.D.
7/26/99 Yes, I absolutely favor posting the Ten Commandments in every school! It is of paramount importance that students condemn EVERYONE who draws pictures, works on Saturday, or covets a neighbor's ox! Upon second thought, maybe it would be more rational to post copies of the pillar containing the Code of Hammurabi, exhibited now in the Louvre, rather than cite something that allegedly flew in out of the sky Warren Allen Smith, FANNY (Freethinking Activist Non-believing New Yorkers) via Internet Paul Lozowsky of LISH has suggested posting the entire penal code on school walls, but I'm worried that Jerry Falwell might object to the word "penal." G.D.
7/30/99 Short answer: No. But you expected that. Longer answer: First, which Ten Commandments? The Catholic, Protestant or Jewish Ten Commandments differ in important ways. Tell us which one you mean, then we'll address them individually. Second, in general though, a significant number of them deal strictly with man's relationship with God, which has no bearing on man's relationship with man, and so can provide no moral guidance for life on earth. Third, most of those left deal only with relationships within one's tribe. Before one can decide whether or not to use them as moral precepts, one must decide how they apply to modern life. Do they apply to all of mankind? Ones compatriots? Ones race? Ones religion? How about only those of ones compatriots, ones own race, that agree with ones religion? So, the long answer is still "no." Isaac via Internet It is conveniently overlooked that while the biblical Commandments urge one not to kill, the biblical God soon is demanding the killing of peoples outside of the selected tribe, and sometimes even of those in the tribe! Go figure. G.D.
7/30/99 Absolutely not. The first four mean nothing and the remainder are better taught as secular, natural law. Tying superstitions into moral guidance is ludicrous at best. Larry L a.k.a. Infidel Do we really have to teach kids not to covet oxen? Maybe we can change it to Pokemon. G.D.
7/31/99 The State should not promote the teaching of the biblical Ten Commandments. I believe this clearly violates the separation of church and government, and encourages a specific religious doctrine. I do believe it is ok for public schools to offer religious teachings as electives. I think the public school systems need to begin to offer more classes that address the philosophical, moral, and certainly practical needs of our young people. I believe an education in parenting would be very wise, as well as sexuality, and law, crimes & punishment. Why can't we address the problems of our society directly with education? It is high time the educational system take more responsibility for turning out responsible, enlightened and inspiringly noble people. We know parents should be doing this, but aren't always capable. Why not have the education system spend more time offering electives, and summer programs which could teach the above mentioned topics, as well as other courses young people are interested in. Stephen F., masters level psychologist via Internet The idea that ethics be taught in public schools and summer schools should not be construed as taking parents off the hook. It is just another thing that might help. G..
8/3/99 No!!!!! Even though I don't think killing a human or warm blooded animal is an action I would do nor take someone else's spouse or property, etc., the use of the "Ten Commandments" as a moral guide is NOT acceptable to me or other rational non-Christian/Jews I know of. How about leaving the killing and stealing, etc., as LAWS. The taking of the spouse and other infractions can be left as they are today, non-criminal actions that can be addressed in psychotherapy or other litigation arenas. Annita via Internet Wow! Someone ought to mention the concept of LAWS to our legislators. Amazing how this slipped passed them! G.D.
8/4/99 For a well-developed answer to this question, read "The Immorality of the Ten Commandments," which will appear in the forthcoming September/October issue of the Humanist magazine. Fred Edwords, Executive Director, American Humanist Association via Internet Thanks for the info. For information on the AHA or the magazine one can call 1-800-743-6646 or 1-716-839-5080 or visit http://humanist.net on the web. G.D.
8/6/99 No, the state should not promote the Biblical Ten Commandments in any way. The Commandments are religious and a violation of the law and of the First Amendment. It is the time, now, when a new secular Ten Commandments be written and voted on by all the citizens of this country, one that would be accepted by all religions. When we look at the few versions of the Ten Commandments that were written hundreds of years ago, and we can see that the commandments make little sense in our time. Truthfully, they are silly and worthless and illogical. We could start with the Penal Law or the Code of Criminal Procedure. Larceny is a violation of the law. If you violate this law you will be punished. Killing of a human being, (murder) is a violation of the law. You will be punished according to the law. We could have a few so-called Ten Commandments. Lets say one for the grammar schools, one for the home and neighborhood, and one for all to read and obey. Paul L. via Internet Actually all you are really suggesting is LAWS which we ALL ought to obey because they're fair and make life better. Do people really behave because of the fear of god(s)? If that were true we wouldn't need laws would we? But the fact is, indeed we do. In no way should secular laws, which ideally would apply only to actions that may cause harm, apply to beliefs which reside in the sanctity of our minds. G.D.
8/7/99 As an parent and atheist, I must say NO. Although there are some very good values that may be derived from the Ten Commandments, there is entirely too much religious implication to justify such an act. The First Commandment states "Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image." This Commandment alone is the basis for the subjugation of other faiths, and has potential to cause confusion in those who are pagan in upbringing, atheist, Jewish, Muslim, and any other child who is brought up in an alternate religion or faith group. It is the duty of parents to teach their children morality, not the state. More importantly, it is the duty of the parents to teach their children religion, and all religious reference should be kept out of the schools. The only possible exception to this rule would be an all-inclusive course on religion in general taught by an impartial party. Even this, I feel, is a direction that schools should not go. The Second Commandment, "Thou shalt not take the name of the lord thy god in vane," would force the belief that there is in fact a god and that to use his name in any other than a holy sense will cause you eternal damnation. This is an especially cruel thing to tell a pagan child, or an atheist child. Especially when they are taught at home that such a god does not even exist. More confusion. Even the Third Commandment, "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy" clearly offends the First Amendment by teaching that you must respect a religious holy day. I cannot abide this. I will not say that the remainder of the Commandments does not illustrate admirable values. They do. If the state decides that moral instruction is necessary, then a list of rules may not be a bad idea, but the biblical 10 Commandments is definitely NOT the way to go. Rev. Kenneth R. Hart Amen, Reverend. G.D.
On other topics: 7/26/99 Re: Calling squid "sewage": Umph. My father's parents came to America from Sicily. You have not offended my father or me. In fact, my father has told me that if he never has to eat another squid or octopus again, that's just fine with him. His father was a fisherman, so my dad had plenty of opportunities to sample seafood. So at least two members of the Italian community are not offended. Lynn B. via Internet Thanks, Lynn. For your info I am also of 100% Sicilian ancestry, and the squid complainer, Scott M. is as Italian as gefilte fish. Thanks for your kind support. G.D.
7/27/99 Dear LISH, I enjoyed reading the material you sent and with your permission, will share some of it with our own local group, humanists of the Nature Coast, here in the heart of Florida's bible belt. Thanks for including us. Jackie E. via Internet Glad to be of service. G.D.
8/4/99 The LISH picnic was a success from my point of view. I got to know (and even remember the names) of some interesting people. Sherm C. And the rest of us surely enjoyed the zucchini that you brought. Thanks very much. G.D.
NEW YORK AREA SKEPTICS (NYASk) The New York Area Skeptics is a terrific organization that should appeal to many secular humanists. The group has monthly meetings and a newsletter that deals with claims of the paranormal, medical quackery and any other topic that calls for a critical examination. They meet at the Plainview-Old Bethpage Public Library, 999 Old Country Rd., Plainview, Nassau County. For info call 516 827-9506 or visit the website @ www.liii.com/~nyask.