THE JAGGED EDGE OF FAME
Alanis Morissette talks about dealing with sudden stardom
BY: Mark Brown

        It's only a pop song, Alanis Morissette said. Yet critics are taking the tack that she's poisoned the minds of little schoolchildren everywhere with Ironic.

        Yes, Morissette knows that every situation described in the song -- rain on your wedding day, a free ride when you've already paid -- doesn't meet the dictionary definition of irony. Still, critics felt compelled to devote entire essays to the concept of irony and how Ironic doesn't caputure it.

        Geez. Had she known how much it would upset people, she'd have looked it up and changed a word here or there. But she's got a better suggestion -- get over it, guys.

        This is just the latest round of backlash against the Canadian who blew into the public eye a year ago with her album JLP, which has sold 13 million copies.

        The critical nitpicking is to be expected. The buzz around Morissette isn't that she's just the hottest new female singer since

        Madonna, the owner of Morissette's label, Matador Records. (Yep, that's really what they wrote : O ) The buzz is that we're witnessing the birth of an icon --someone who could become her own larger - than - life - one - name industry and cross over into other areas of the arts. Like Madonna. Like Whitney. Like Cher.

        By now everyone knows her story. She grew up an actress on a TB show, YCDTOTV, and released two frothy dance-pop albums that made her a teen idol in Canada.

        She wanted a more honest album and collaborated with veteran producer Glen Ballard to make the soulful blast that became JLP, often writing and recording songs within a few hours. The single YOK was a hit right out of the box, but also stereotyped her as a raging young woman until follow-up hits such as YL and Ironic exposed her more to the public.

        Next came platinum albums and Grammys. Virtually unknown in the US a year ago, she's now selling out big arenas and even is able to bring along bands she admires, such as Radiohead, ad the opening acts.

        But the debate continues. Supporters call JLP an example of incredible artistic growth by Morissette; detractors still look at it as a calculated, by-the-numbers peice of Gen X Product.

        Whatever.

        The incredibly self-assured Morissette doesn't care what her detractors think. Two days before her recent 22nd birthday, Morissette talked by phone from Portland, where she was preparing to kick off her biggest tour ever.

        Q: You've kept a low profile since the Grammy's. Is that on purpose?

        A: I try to keep a low profile in general. Not with my art, but just as a person. Anything I do has to be directly related to my music. If it isn't, I don't really see a point to it.

        Q: How is fame different this time around?

        A: The reason why I'm a lot more peaceful now, ironically, a lot more so that when I was younger and I had this on a smaller scale, was that when I was younger, my perception of all this was different. I was motivated by just thinking that if you had all this external success that everyone would love you and everything would be peaceful and wonderful. I found the opposite to be quite true, in fact. I saw music as a way to entertain people and take them away from their daily lives and put smiles on their faces, as opposed to what I see it being now, which is a way for me to actually communicate, and a way for me to tap into my subconscious. I didn't realize that I would be able to do that through music, for many reasons, including myself being my own saboteur and being in creative environments that were not conducive to my feeling free and injudged.

        Q: How do you deal with fans who see you as a spokeswoman for their generation?

        A: I see the whole concept of Generation X implies that everyone has lost hope. I can agree with that, and I can understand why; thinkgs like my parents coming out of high school or university with five or six jobs waiting for them, and people my age coming out of university with a degree and every reason to get jobs and having no potential jobs and being in the same position as someone who left high school in Grade 8. Just our times are different. So obviously, our mind-sets are going to be different. But at the same time I don't think that an entire generation should be underestimated. I happen to be lucky in that I knew what I wanted to do as far as a career since I was nine years old. I was blessed in that I could tap into what I loved to do that turned me into something that could put food on my table at a very young age. That's the only difference I see between myself and anyone else my age.

        Q: Has the success of singles besides YOK killed off the angry-young-woman stereotype?

        A: Yeah. When YOK first came out and that was the only song you heard, I completely understood why people had that perception of me. I just thought that it was obviously such a one-dimensional thing to call someone simply an angry person. It's just so one-dimensional. I have an angry part of my personality, definitely. But I think once people heard the rest of the songs, I think it went away.

        Q: How do you deal with the new criticisms -- the tweaking of your use of "ironic" for instance?

        A: (laughs) That's funny. I did actually hear that one. For someone to take that much time to analyze something like that when it's just something that is...I guess what people forget sometimes is that when I write songs, I write them sometimes in about 20 minutes. And it was just a snapshot of that moment. It's not something that I foresaw turning into a song, first of all, that I'd have to sing every night for a year. Or something that I thought millions of people would be listening to. Honestly, it was something that I just wrote as anyone would write a poem, for a high school project. They write it, then they honestly think they'll never have to read it again, really. And that's kind of how I saw my songs.

        Q: Given that, are there any you might look back on and not want to perform in coming years?

        A: Maybe. I don't know. Let me think...No, I think a lot of what I wrote about on this record was in retrospect to begin with. So if I were to sing it in years from now, it would just be further back in retrospect.

        Q: Glen said the two of you plan to work together again. Do you think you can re-create the chemistry you had for JLP?

        A: The viewpoint I have, as Glen does, I think, is that we're not trying to re-create it. I think we truly just scratched the surface of what we wanted to do just as friends. This is beyond whether it was going to go on the record or not,. There are many things I want to talk about. There's so much to say. There's so much to create. And so many observations that I've made over the last year that I just can't wait to release. This is regardless of whether it goes on the record or not. So he and I are not going to go back into the studio trying to re-create Jagged Little Pill, Part II. Definitely not. No.

Alanis Morissette’s current album has sold more than 30 million copies worldwide. A measure of her success here, well a few months back she played to an indoor Auckland sports stadium. Tonight she sold out the 10,000+ Supertop on the last gig of an 18 month tour.

        Q - The Mona Lisa’s got nothing on Alanis Morissette. An egmatic stupesize (don’t have a clue how to spell this or what it means) a word for this architect the pop music mindscapes.

        A - I don’t listen to anyone’s opinions about my songs really. I um...particularly when I’m creating them if I... you know when I was younger I actually wanted constructive criticism and I thought that it would help me out and it didn’t. I think art is such a personal thing and everyone is so individual that how could I possibly tell you or anyone how to create something or paint something. Its like someone painting something and saying, You know you should use more yellow but you didn’t feel like using yellow. That’s how I see it.

        Q - I mean do you like being out at the moment? Does it feel good or does it not feel any different than before?

        A - Well it feels good. It definitely feels different you know, my character and my personality is tested and challenged almost daily. I think that has helped me to have even more conviction about what I am as a person.

        Q - I’ve always thought that’s really important to have, do you? or...

        A - Yep and I think that unless, unless you are in it you don’t realise how, how um.. important it is. I mean unless you are deprived of your privacy, you don’t know how important it is. It’s like most things anyway but um, that’s definitely a part of it, you know and the other part of it is that when you are in the position that I’m in or anyone else is when they’re in the public eye and they’re creating things and communicating it. It’s just a lot of energy. A lot of energy output. I give to a lot of people and...

        Q - Maybe not the fame...moneys good to have.

        A - Its definitely good to have. If you have um... I think if you have the right view of it. I mean money can give you freedom, money can give you um...piece of mind and security knowing that if and when I were to have children in 10 or however many years that, that I can do that.

        I don’t know about being married. I don’t know if I’ll ever get married. I might but I am definitely going to have children. Definitely!

        I think the whole concept of critics whether its about music or movies or anything. I just, to this day still don’t understand it. You know, commissioning someone to say whether they hate or love something. I don’t know why people are interested in hearing another person’s opinion.

        I know what a good or a bad song is to me but I’ve come to learn that just because I think a song is a great one, doesn’t mean that anyone else will and vice versa.

        I conflictly argue with my drummer on what we think is good and bad music and we agree now and again but its only once in a while! (laughs)

Good Evening. Ask your children; you’ve probably started listening to her yourself but anyway your children will tell you she’s awesome. She’s a mere 22 years old. She’s Alanis Morissette and her album Jagged Little Pill it sold an excess of 30 million copies around the world. Its the biggest selling album by a female artist, ever. The songs are painful, they’re raw, they’re sexy, they’re vengeful, they’re tender. Very big night for her tonight. Alanis Morissette ends 18 months of touring around the world. She plays in Auckland and thats it. Its time off. New directions, new songs to work on. The end of the world tour. Earlier on this afternoon Alanis came into the Holmes studio and she did the only interview she’s going to be doing in New Zealand. So much fame and success so quickly? I said to her. Hard to handle? I said to her. Alanis Morissette.

        Cuts to Alanis sitting at a desk across from Paul Holmes. She's wearing a black baby T and jeans and boots (I think). Oh and how could I forget! She's wearing black nail polish! Paul Holmes is in his usual suit.

        Alanis - Um...The external success uh...has not been all that hard to handle on a personal level, probably because I’m not motivated by it now, but I...that....when it first happened it was a really big adjustment definitely. Yeah...

        Paul - Well do you ever sit back and think... well I mean I know you’re not motivated by record sales and prizes and things like that but do you ever sit back and think 30 million copies? The biggest album by a female ever. I mean do you ever think, well, not bad?

        Alanis - I think its heartening in that in 1996 a record that has sold this many copies is not solely about love. You know I think it says a lot to me about this era really, that people are interested in hearing other peoples revelations, other peoples confusions and frustration’s and emotions and um.. it doesn’t scare them away. I think thats a great thing.

        Paul - Its a tribute to your contact with people isn’t it?

        Alanis - Sure, its a tribute with my being honest with myself first and foremost and then having it be something that other people related to and perhaps inspired them to do the same with themselves.

        Paul - Are you as vulnerable now as when you made this LP?...

        Alanis - Um...

        Paul - ...Before the world tour? Before the success? Before the 30 million?

        Alanis - Yeah, I think that I’m uh, I’m just less apologetic about my vulnerability. When I first started out, there was a small bit of fear about being that open but not any more.

        Paul - 30 million sales if I may repeat that figure! (laughs) means that you don’t have to apologise to anyone surely!

        Alanis - No. I mean well I wouldn’t have had to anyway. Once the record was done I just felt like I had done what I needed to do.

        Paul - You’ve been touring about 18 months...

        Alanis - Mmm hmm...

        Paul - And this is your 2nd to last night away. Does that feel good?

        Alanis - Yeah, uh, my smile says it all right now. We’ve had an amazing time and we’ve all been...we’ve all been very uh...we’ve all been troopers but I think its time to stop and regroup and reflect and take a break.

        Paul - Are you dee mop happy (I think thats how you spell it)

        Alanis - (looks confused)

        Paul - I mean do you...dee mop; army term, your parents taught at military academies so...

        Alanis - Oh, right...(laughs)

        Paul - Dee mop happy means you can see the end.

        Alanis - Yes I’m...I’m beyond that!

        Paul - I would imagine one of the scary things about being as successful with that first album and then winning the 4 Grammy’s and then so forth, first album out. Is worrying about that next album, how do you follow that? Is that a worry to you?

        Alanis - Um no! I uh... I think that if I uh...

        Paul - Its such a long question and not a worry!

        Alanis - (laughs) I’ll explain why there’s no worry.

        Paul - I’m sorry (laughs)

        Alanis - Um...I think um...I think if I was motivated again by recreating what this record did externally, which essentially I had no control over um...I think that it would drive me crazy...I think the pressure would be too much but as I said I think that as long as I finish the record and love it, if it sells 10 copies or 10 million copies, I can’t control that. No one can control that you know.

        Paul - Tell me about the making of Jagged Little Pill. I mean it seems to be, you sang the tracks in a weekend.

        Alanis - Yeah, what we’d do is that we would write and record at the same time which is the way that I’d like to do it for the rest of my life just because it captures the spirit and um...we didn’t go through everything with a fine tooth comb. I didn’t want to um...get away from the original emotion that was, you know, was the inspiration of writing the song.

        Paul - Yes because one of the wonderful and appealing things and unforgettable things about Jagged Little Pill was that, there’s a kind of newness about the songs as if you’re not quite familiar with them yourself in...in some ways. I mean its...

        Alanis - Right

        Paul - Its real fresh and...

        Alanis - Yeah, all of the vocals were one or two takes right there.

        Paul - So many of your songs are also about um...I’m sure you’re sick of...I bet you’re sick of people telling you this. You may be. So many of your songs seem to be about being hurt and yet at the same time allowing that to enrich your life.

        Alanis - Mmm hmm.

        Paul - That you seem to love the fullness of it all.

        Alanis - Right.

        Paul - I recommend getting your heart trampled on...and...

        Alanis - That’s right, just accepting, accepting all emotions and not seeing society has a way of making people believing that, that frustration and confusion and sadness is dark and wrong and that happiness is right and I believe that every emotion can be celebrated.

        Paul - A lot of hurt there though; You Oughta Know, Right Through You, um...Would You Forgive Me Love(means Your House)? I mean they’re about some real hurt in relationships. Do you still allow yourself to get that hurt?

        Alanis - Um... I don’t think just judging from the place I’m coming from now, I don’t know if I’ll ever be that hurt, but I will be hurt. I think thats inevidival but um...its much more easily transcended now as opposed to before when you weren’t equipped with the knowledge that comes from getting older.

        Paul - Do you have a relationship at the moment?

        Alanis - Yes I do.

        Paul - Oh yes.

        Alanis - Mmm hmm.

        Paul - Is this person based back in LA?

        Alanis - Yes.

        Paul - Not on the road?

        Alanis - No.

        Paul - Who is it?

        Alanis - (laughs)I don’t have to go there right now!

        Paul - No, no you don’t and you don’t have to tell me either. Who are your heroes?

        Alanis - Um... I don’t know if I have heroes pursay, but I do have people that I respect.

        Paul - Joni Mitchell was one of those?

        Alanis - Yeah, I was only introduced to her music after my record was done my manager gave it to me and said that he thought that I’d be able to relate to a lot of it.

        Paul - And what do you who do you listen to at the moment, when you go back to the hotel or when you’re on the bus or on the plane?

        Alanis - Um... I don’t really listen to anything uh...much to the shagreen of people around me who really enjoy listening to music.

        Paul - You don’t need to listen to it Alanis, there’s nobody near you! Nobody near you!

        Alanis - Oh! (has a "I can't believe you just said that!" look on her face) I don’t know about that but I love silence right now for obvious reasons. Lifes very noisy and crazy and I just, uh... I just like to be silent.

        Paul - Hmm. Are you writing songs all the time?

        Alanis - I’m writing a lot of poems lately, just thoughts that will probably at some point become songs but I want to become a student again, and become a guitar student and a piano student. Yeah.

        Paul - Well of course, after the success of the last 18 months you’ll have a bit of free time.

        Alanis - Yeah.

        Paul - If you want...

        Alanis - I need...free time! (Big smile)

        Paul - You are very kindly, I know Alanis going to do a couple of songs.

        Alanis: We are.

        Paul - And you’re going to do, You Learn...?

        Alanis - Yep, You Learn and Head Over Feet, we’re going to do.

        Paul - We’ve jacked up a sound stage especially for you.

        Alanis - Thank you for that.

        Paul: - It’s a great pleasure and if you could make your way over there now if you would...

        Alanis - Alright.

        Paul - And you got the band there sitting waiting I know...

        Alanis - Yes I do. Thank you.

        Paul - And we’ve got flowers there and a carpet too. Whatever you want!

        Alanis - (laughs)

        Goes to Alanis sitting crosslegged with the rest of her band on a stage covered with a Persian rug and lots of flowers in the background. It all looks very hippyish. I can see her band members Taylor Hawkins, Jessie Tobias, Nick Lashly and Chris Channey. Oh yeah and Jessie's wearing black nail polish too! Alanis must have got him! There are also 2 other guys there sitting with them (I recognise them as the two guys walking alongside Alanis when entering Auckland airport). One is playing a small hand drum and the others playing a guitar. There is also a woman beside Alanis playing a maraca. Instead of drums, Taylor is playing the other maraca. She starts off singing the acoustic version of Head Over Feet and plays the guitar and harmonica. She’s really great!

        Then there is another story on the show about something else.

        Then we come back to Alanis. This time she sings an acoustic version of You Learn Live! Its quite interesting because you know how she goes totally crazy and jumps around in concert during this song? Well she can’t really do that here because they’re all sitting crosslegged on quite a small stage. So she just goes, oooh weee ohh, and yi yi yi and la da da etc. Its really cool! Anyway this time the woman sitting next to Alanis is playing Alanis’ guitar and Taylor now has 2 maracas and is playing them like drums! Then at the end of the song she says Thank you (something???) - I couldn’t make out her exact words but she seemed to be directing it towards her band. Then Paul Holmes comes and sits on the stage.

        Paul - That’s fabulous! Thank you very much for coming in!

        Alanis - Thanks for having us. Its good talking to you again (referring back to when he interviewed her in May / then she shakes his hand / then she has a drink of water)

        Paul - Its a great honour to be on your last television appearance before the end of the world tour. Thanks for coming in!

        Alanis - Thanks for having us!

        Paul - And go and do that concert!

        Alanis - (laughs)

        Paul - And get it finished with!

        Alanis - (laughs louder)

        Then it cuts back to Paul at his desk.

        Paul - Last concert of the world tour and tomorrow they’re home.